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Post by admin on Jan 30, 2013 19:35:34 GMT 2
I would like to start a thread on contemporary issues, because I'm sure that everyone here is familiar with them. So, let's see: what do you think about: - abortion?
- contraceptives?
- secular humanism?
- secularism?
- fight against the Church?
- you can add as many as you wish...
Please (obviously), keep an Orthodox perspective, if possible. |
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Post by timotheos on Jan 30, 2013 20:54:18 GMT 2
The opinions I have formed thus far:
Abortion- unethical, and synonymous with murder. I can see it being permissible, however, if the pregnancy endangers the life of the mother.
Contraceptives- I've heard arguments for and against. Arguments for contraception (within the boundaries of marriage) are that they can be used as an effective means of spacing out time between children and can help enhance the expression of marital love. As long as the contraceptive does not have an abortive effect (in that it does not interrupt an embryo that has been formed), and if it is under the guidance of a spiritual advisor, I understand there are some Orthodox theologians and clergy who find contraceptives permissible under these circumstances.
Secular humanism- the attempt to elevate atheism to the status of a religion, without calling it a religion. My thoughts of this movement are negative and I hold many (but not all) secular humanists in disdain for their general lack of understanding of religious traditions, their pitting of science and religion against each other (despite science and religion serving different purposes), and the pompous notion of "freethinkers" (as if people who are traditionally religious are somehow not capable of logic).
Secularism- still forming my opinion. I see pros and cons for the separation of Church and State, though I believe it to be beneficial when there is a harmony between Church and State (I might post more information on this when I have read more).
Fight against the Church- if I may ask, Andrei, does this refer to having disagreements with the Church over certain issues (in the way that, for example, some Catholics may be supportive of abortion, despite the Roman Catholic Church's anti-abortion stance)?
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Post by admin on Jan 30, 2013 21:13:45 GMT 2
Regarding fight against the Church, Timotheos, it doesn't refer to being is a disagreement with the Church, but fighting to impose that disagreement on the followers of the Church - on christians. Works much like secular humanism and secularism. It doesn't mean simple disagreement, but also activism to support that disagreement - conscious activism.
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Post by JamesfromTA on Jan 30, 2013 22:38:53 GMT 2
I like this thread, haha!
Abortion- I agree with timotheos on this completely. The Didache, the Church Fathers; all were clear that abortion is completely unethical as it takes a human life. Then you have the account that when the Blessed Ever-Virgin Mary was carrying Christ St. John the Baptist leapt in his mothers womb.
Contraception- I haven't actually formed an opinion on this one (strangely enough! =P )
Secular humanism- Not at all surprised that this movement is growing as it seems to fit in well with the atheistic materialism/ individualism that is everywhere these days. I find it quite an arrogant movement, never used to but the more I got exposed to it online and in real life at university the more I came to view it as such. It seems that many people within that seem to view themselves as being superior to others and it's this superiority complex which is concerning.
Secularism- Where I live isn't a secular country (seeing as the C of E is still established though after their synod didn't go the way they wanted who knows if that will change) but it is definitely a place where secular humanists are without a doubt gaining more ground and a much louder voice. The polemic of secularists here scares me because they don't seem to want a balanced relationship between Church and State but they seem to want to crush the Church using the State. In a multi-religious society I'm not completely opposed to the theory of secularism and I can see how in certain parts of the world it would be beneficial, but how it works in practice I don't know. All I see are secular groups basing their arguments on false accounts of history, claiming not to be against faith (whilst pushing a token theist up and about every now and again) but then using arguments that Lenin would be proud of which does not make me view it favourably. There was a debate at my old university with the motion "a secular society is a better society" between the secular humanists on campus (the then leader of which is actually a friend of mine) and my former reverend when I was an Anglican. Surprisingly despite the majority of the people in the audience being for the motion before the debate the secularists ended up losing.
Fight against the Church- I've not seen much of this in the Orthodox Church if I'm honest. Not in this country any way, not yet. It might be different in other countries though.
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Post by Vlad on Jan 31, 2013 8:12:22 GMT 2
Abortion - I cannot see any way to get around it. There is absolutely no reason for an Orthodox Christian to approve abortion. It's one of the contemporary social issues I am very strongly against, and depending on my position in the future, I will be fighting it to the end.
Contraceptives - I don't know the Church teaching on this, however, I think that the primary reason for marital intercourse is procreation. Pleasurability of intercourse is secondary, and as a result, there is a certain amount of caution that should be practiced when it comes to contraceptives. Regardless, I feel that if I get married young and still in university, I doubt I'll be able to/want to have kids at that time.
It's an issue for discussion with one's spiritual father.
Secular humanism - I think secular humanism is self-glorifying, flawed, and has horrible implications. I don't think most secular-humanists are like this, however, the philosophical implication of humanism is rather terrible, since it states that morality and justice is in the hands of human beings, elevating humans to the level to which we (Christians) put God. That puts moraltiy at a subjective level, and this can have horrible consequences, since there is nothing outside of the individual ego to declare something to be right or wrong. Stalin and Hitler's actions were disagreeable, but not wrong.
Secularism - Secularism is alright with me since I think there should be a seperation of Church and state. Each have their own responsibilities, and I think that working together is a vitality in society, since religion (or irreligious) is such a large part of society.
Fght against the Church - Completely against. The Church shouldn't "get with the times", the times should get with the Church. Any opposition to established Church dogma should be anathematized.
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Post by OrthodoxBrit on Mar 27, 2013 0:11:48 GMT 2
Abortion?
Clearly ending a living being's existence. Enough said there.
contraceptives?
unlike Abortion,t his prevents the creation of life. I can see where people have issues with it devaluing sex but the Church itself has no condemnation of this, especially with communities in areas damaged by the spread of aids, it also takes part in sensible family planning. I have no issue with a married couple using contraception to regulate their family.
secular humanism?
This has always existed, it always will. The spread is obviously an annoyance but so was paganism, Islam and the crusades. God has promised the survival of his Church and I trust in that.
secularism?
Let Caesar so as he will, he is none of our concern. if the Government want to be against the Church then so be it. We should not complain and act like politicians, we never saw the fathers do that We should emulate them and continue with our Spiritual development instead of caring about politicians.
fight against the Church?
That is a person's prerogative and a matter for the Church to deal with. We see heresies such as Ethnophyletism all over yet no-one speaks out. It is not for us to fight our brothers but their spiritual fathers to teach them.
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