elionberger
Hermit
Orthodox Church of Korea
Catechumen
Posts: 65
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Post by elionberger on Jul 24, 2012 3:01:56 GMT 2
Hello my dear online Orthodox friends!
I am a catechumen in the Orthodox church here in South Korea. I am originally from the states (Colorado).
I want to start a discussion thread that is based on a particular reading (book, article, etc.) that we all can agree on. It could be a sort of book club/study group where we all commonly read the same thing and post our questions and thoughts.
If those of you that are experienced, ordained, and/or wise beyond the ages of ages could recommend some good reads for those of us on the journey, we could create a poll and a take a vote. This way, we can choose a common read, and get started.
Any help and suggestions would be appreciated.
So, if you send me ideas of good reads, I'll compile a list and create a poll. Once we vote, I can set up a reading schedule to everybody's liking.
Thanks Andrei!! for putting this awesome forum together . . I have good feelings about this. Living in the middle of South Korea, it is hard to find people in my neighborhood to speak with about Orthodoxy, Jesus, and my faith. So, this is just wonderful!
Cheers everybody! Looking forward to this . . .
-erik
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Post by Vlad on Jul 24, 2012 3:40:33 GMT 2
Heya Erik! Welcome to the forum.
As for books, at the moment I am reading "The Orthodox Way" by Bishop (Now Metropolitan) Kallistos Ware. It's a great read, and I highly recommend it to everyone. Of course, there is the Orthodox Study Bible, which is a great way to read the Bible, and see the Orthodox perspective on things.
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Post by reachingfortheheavens on Jul 24, 2012 5:43:20 GMT 2
In terms of books I have read and can recommend about Orthodoxy, "The Orthodox Way" is indeed a good one, and I also liked "For the Life of the World" by Alexander Schmemann. "The Mystical Theology of the Eastern Church" by Vladimir Lossky is a good one too.
My favorite book on Orthodoxy that I've read so far was "On Prayer" by Sophrony Sakharov, but it's not really an intro-to-Orthodoxy type of book.
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Post by OrthodoxBrit on Jul 24, 2012 9:06:39 GMT 2
The usual first two that people are suggested are 'the orthodox church' and 'the orthodox way' by met. Kallistos ware.
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Justina
Monastic
Coptic Orthodox Church of Alexandria
Posts: 25
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Post by Justina on Jul 24, 2012 10:40:06 GMT 2
The usual first two that people are suggested are 'the orthodox church' and 'the orthodox way' by met. Kallistos ware. Yep, those are good places to start. I'm reading 'The Orthodox Church' at the moment. |
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Post by simplyorthodox on Jul 24, 2012 10:48:54 GMT 2
Hello Erik!
Well, in my blog's sidebar I've made a list with great books (29 so far) that are really useful. I've started to read some of them in Greek, and they definately strengthen my faith!
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Post by JamesfromTA on Jul 24, 2012 11:02:00 GMT 2
I was just thinking that it would definitely be a good thing to have a Catechumen board where we could discuss things like this just so its easy for Catechumens (and perhaps people interested in the faith as well) to find things?
There are a few books that I found really useful as a Catechumen;
-'The Orthodox Way' by Met. Kallistos Ware.
Its a really great read on the spirituality of the Church.
- 'The Orthodox Church' by Met. Kallistos Ware.
This was the first one I read. Its on the history of the Church and its absolutely fantastic. It also has a pretty good bibliography for further reading.
- 'The Orthodox Church; an introduction to its history, doctrine and spiritual culture' by John Anthony McGuckin.
That one takes on a similar format to the books by Met. Kallistos Ware but it also covers things like bio-ethics and makes for a nice supplement for the books by Met. Kallistos Ware in my opinion as a lot of what Met. Kallistos says is reinforced.
-'The Mystical Theology of the Eastern Church' by Vladimir Lossky.
A fantastic book. I would highly recommend it, though after reading something a bit easier to understand like the 'Orthodox Way'. It might take a few reads to start getting your head around some of what he is talking about but its fantastic nonetheless.
-'The Desert Fathers: Sayings of the Early Christian monks' by Penguin Classics.
This (alongside Met. Kallistos Ware's book, 'The Orthodox Church') was recommended to me by my Deacon when I first became a Catechumen and I would strongly recommend it to anyone interested in the faith or people in the faith who aren't too familiar with the Desert Fathers and Mothers.
- 'The Faith we hold' by Archbishop Paul of Finland.
I was given this as a present for my Chrismation but its intended for Catechumens and inquirers. It basically contains all the basics of the faith (all the need-to-knows) and its short (only 96 pages) as well as being really easy to read and to follow. Everything is put simply so that pretty much anyone can understand it.
The only other thing I would recommend is the Gospels. Read them over and over again. The Orthodox Study Bible is great because it contains teachings of the faith as well as morning/ evening prayers and a section on how to read the Bible. If you like icons it also has iconographic inserts in it that come as part of the study Bible. Its an absolutely fantastic resource and will help you to become familiar with the Bible incredibly quickly.
Sorry about the lengthy post!
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Post by OrthodoxBrit on Jul 24, 2012 11:44:18 GMT 2
The only other thing I would recommend is the Gospels. Read them over and over again. The Orthodox Study Bible is great because it contains teachings of the faith as well as morning/ evening prayers and a section on how to read the Bible. If you like icons it also has iconographic inserts in it that come as part of the study Bible. Its an absolutely fantastic resource and will help you to become familiar with the Bible incredibly quickly. With regards to the OSB, be careful. Cross check it with books such as "Ancient Christian commentary on Scriptures" (Most books can be seen on google books) or another reputable source of Church Father commentaries and with a copy of the LXX Septuagint, as it has taken a lot of criticism in the past few years for not being what it is supposed to. I think they are currently in the process of a Redux also. The old testament in this book is not the LXX Septuagint but a hybrid of the masoretic and Septuagint. I have personally stopped using it due to this, as it has translations of verses and even verses which are not correct to the Greek. I would personally suggest just reading from the LXX Septuagint and picking up one or two Orthodox commentaries on whatever you are reading. I personally use Fr. Tadros Malaty's commentaries as he has 3 or 4 Church fathers' responses to every verse as well as an explanation from his view, which helps put things in context. |
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Post by JamesfromTA on Jul 24, 2012 16:05:42 GMT 2
That's really good advise, I think I'm going to look into the LXX (I thought the OSB did use the LXX). If that's the case it might be worth having a look at looking at getting other things for cross reference (as I am going to do right now, haha!). Does anyone know where to get the New Testament as well, I'm certain the OSB New Testament translation differs from the New Testament we use in Church.
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elionberger
Hermit
Orthodox Church of Korea
Catechumen
Posts: 65
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Post by elionberger on Jul 24, 2012 16:18:36 GMT 2
These have all been really great suggestions. I will compile everyone's recommendations and put together a poll for us to vote on (unless anybody has a better idea).
Also, I use the King James bible . . always have . . I don't really know much about what Orthodoxbrit talks about when he refers to "septuagint" and all that . . You all can educate me . .
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Post by OrthodoxBrit on Jul 25, 2012 1:53:07 GMT 2
Sorry for Thr technical lingo there, I'll try and summarise. If anyone can add anything, please do.
The LXX Septuagint is the Greek translation of the OT. It was formulated by the orders of Ptolemy II of Egypt for hellenised Jews in Alexandria and was the translation used by the Early Church before the Vulgate and other language versions were brought about. It dates around 100 years earlier than the authoritative Masoretic (Hebrew) which was used for the Latin Vulgate and most subsequent OT translations.
Because of these factors it is still the preferred source of OT translation for most orthodox as the Hebrew was traditionally seen as corrupted over time to hide some details which may pertain to prophecy of Christ.
It is called Septuagint (Or LXX) as the traditional story is that Ptolemy put 72 Scholars in seperate rooms and asked them to Translate the Old Hebrew into Greek and they all had identical translations. It has quite a few notable differences in translation and even the organisation if some biblical texts, to the Masoretic, so I always like to check what I am using.
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elionberger
Hermit
Orthodox Church of Korea
Catechumen
Posts: 65
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Post by elionberger on Jul 25, 2012 3:50:09 GMT 2
Thanks for that clarification. I have heard the word Septuagint used ever so often and I had an idea of what it was all about but you, Orthodox Brit, cleared it up for me. I'd like to get my hands on the LXX Septuagint. I can't read Greek, though. Maybe I should start learning. I got my hands full these days though with Korean . .  |
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elionberger
Hermit
Orthodox Church of Korea
Catechumen
Posts: 65
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Post by elionberger on Jul 25, 2012 5:08:31 GMT 2
OK everybody . . . I have put together a poll of seven books that were recommended. Thank you all for your input. You can select your top three choices. Remember, this is for Catechumens and those interested in becoming Orthodox but we do need those experienced in Orthodoxy (The Council) to be a part of the voting and discussion . . . to help guide and advise. The poll will be up for one week. It will close August 1 at noon (Korean time). I am leaving for a week long English camp in the country side so, I will have limited access. Also, this gives a chance for any new comers to join in the voting. Once the poll is closed and a book has been selected, I will put together a reading schedule and start to form questions, etc. (ahhh, my true dorky teacher spirit is coming out . . OK . . happy voting . . you can change your vote anytime during the next week. Cheers, -e. |
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Post by OrthodoxBrit on Jul 25, 2012 10:07:58 GMT 2
Thanks for that clarification. I have heard the word Septuagint used ever so often and I had an idea of what it was all about but you, Orthodox Brit, cleared it up for me. I'd like to get my hands on the LXX Septuagint. I can't read Greek, though. Maybe I should start learning. I got my hands full these days though with Korean . . Not reading Greek is fine. I can trabsliterate but am very poor at it other that the odd Liturgical phrase or Biblical passage. I mainly use English translations of the Septuagint, just because the wording and passages are more trustworthy than the Masoretic based ones. If you start to read one, you notice that some entire chapters are different so when you read the commentaries form the Fathers you encounter the odd issue when certain phrases aren't in Masoretic based versions. |
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elionberger
Hermit
Orthodox Church of Korea
Catechumen
Posts: 65
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Post by elionberger on Jul 25, 2012 15:09:35 GMT 2
Thanks,
I'll have to get my hands on an English translation of the Septuagint . . .
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elionberger
Hermit
Orthodox Church of Korea
Catechumen
Posts: 65
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Post by elionberger on Aug 2, 2012 15:45:38 GMT 2
OK everybody . . . the results are in. "The Orthodox Church" is in the top with nine votes while "The Orthodox Way" follows with eight votes. So, I think it would be great if we just read both. I've heard many great things about Kallistos Ware. I know everybody will be on different reading schedules so I have attached the proposed schedule. Please let me know if you have any criticisms or suggestions. We can start 'officially' on the 6th of August. So, make any recommendations to the readings schedule before then. You can find a couple of online versions of "The Orthodox Church" here: www.synaxis.org/catechist/Orthodox_Church.html (Part One Only) and www.intratext.com/x/eng0804.htm (Parts One and Two) (the attached reading schedule has links to this website) I also think that it would be interesting to supplement the reading with Fr. Thomas Hopko's podcast series "Bishops". Start with Bishops Part One: ancientfaith.com/podcasts/hopko/bishops_part_1_prophetic_priestly_and_pastoralSo, please check out the attached schedule. It is quite long and goes into October but I think it will be great to slowly move through the book and really get some great discussion going. Of course, you can read as much as you want. I do believe that it will be best to keep each week focused to the given topic and pages so we don't stray off topic. We'll need to keep it focused each week. This schedule will take us into October, as I said. At that time, we will have a better understanding of how this online Catechumenal Book Club will go so we can better plan for the next book (which I think should be "The Orthodox Way" since so many of you voted for that and it will follow "The Orthodox Church" nicely). Before the 6th of August, please post only comments about the schudule (suggestions, ideas, criticisms, etc) so I can make any modifications if need be. If you have any ideas for discussion questions please PM me and I'll compile them together to post on the 6th. Until then, start reading "The Orthodox Church" by Kallistos Ware!! Happy Reading . . . and thanks for all the votes . . . Let's make this a successful, enriching experience for everybody. +In Christ Erik Attachments:
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